Moog Theremini!

Thierry wrote: "We haven't any proof yet that the theremini does it "the better way"... I suspect the bean counters at Moog music to have chosen a not too complex solution to maintain the benefits..."

We do have Moog's description of the theremini - "sound engine derived from [...] Animoog" and of Animoog "powered by Moog’s new Anisotropic Synth Engine (ASE), [...] ASE allows you to dynamically move through an X/Y space of unique timbres to create a constantly evolving and expressive soundscape."

This is "the better way" with a two dimensional array (i.e. an X/Y space) of waveforms to morph around - the only question is how much they have simplified it to fit into whatever processor they are using, choice of processor being in the purview of the bean counters. 

"This is "the better way" with a two dimensional array (i.e. an X/Y space) of waveforms to morph around - the only question is how much they have simplified it to fit into whatever processor they are using, choice of processor being in the purview of the bean counters. " - GordonC

Not having a Mac of any kind, ive not been able to play with Animoog - There is an Android app of some kind for the Animmog, but it looks more like some kind of tutorial than a synthesiser, and its not that cheap.. So all ive seen (and heard) is whats on you-tube, and lots of that looks like an interesting experimental controller, with "orbits" and whatever, and a lot of conventional close-to-analogue-synth constructs for sound modifying, as well as some stuff ive not seen before..

What gets me about what ive seen, is that a lot seems to depend on the touch screen interface - I dont understand how one tranlates that into an engine controlled by a theremin (if thats what theyr doing) - I have seen lots of demos with some "molicule" bouncing about and the synth engine giving pleasant sequences from this, but havent seen one demo where any other kind of music is being played - for example - is it possible to play the tannerin line from "Good Vibrations" using this instrument? - I would really love to hear one piece like that, just to get an idea about what one can expect - even if this was played using a MIDI sequencer and loads of portamento ..

Fred.

"soundscape" is the word that sends a chill through me - All too often this is a synonym for a unmanagable and musically nearly unusable canned composite of what someone without anything in common with my musical taste thinks is great - I have boxes of "soundscape" disks for my Yamaha TX16 sampler, and get "Wow, what a cool sound" from teens who play with them but are musical disabled - you dont need to play the bloody things, no matter what key you play they sound the bloody same! - close your eyes and press a key, keep it held down for 3 minutes, the "soundscape" will "evolve" and "morph" - new samples will be introduced in the course of time, all complying with the tempo determined by your randomly selected key - Ather 3 minutes release the key, the release will be about 30 seconds and include the right 'sequencing' and 'morphing' to end your piece in an appropriate manner - take the recording to some ambient event, and vie with the other talented new musicians to get it played....  ;-)

We do have Moog's description of the theremini - "sound engine derived from [...] Animoog" and of Animoog "powered by Moog’s new Anisotropic Synth Engine (ASE), [...] ASE allows you to dynamically move through an X/Y space of unique timbres to create a constantly evolving and expressive soundscape."

Ok, I stand corrected!

I fear that the Open.Theremin in its actual version, based on the Arduino UNO with its ATmega328, will not be able to go so far. This might be improved when Urs Gaudenz will migrate the project (the shield needs to be adapted to an I/O voltage of 3.3V and the DAC might be removed) to the Arduino DUE with an Atmel SAM3X8E which has more memory, is quicker and has two DACs already built in.

For the moment I'm waiting for the Arduino UNO which I ordered on Monday and which was shipped from the UK yesterday. In the meantime I'm analyzing the actual code to learn, to understand, and to see how much functionality can still be squeezed in. Memory will rather not be an issue, but the execution time is very limited since a hardware interrupt comes every 31.25uS to output a new pitch value to the external DAC.

Just theorizing for the moment... I'll have to build the thing and to feel how it behaves before I can think of whatever improvement. I'll do my best to combine my engineer and musician points of view.

" since a hardware interrupt comes every 31.25uS to output a new pitch value to the external DAC." - Thierry

I need to look at the hardware and code to understand anything here, I think - LOL ;-) .. Presumably that interrupt is for outputting one word from the wavetable, and not actually a pitch value? If its a pitch value, then everything I have been saying about WT is complete bull..

But actually, whichever way I run this through my head isnt working - ever had a moment when something you thought you understood completely suddenly makes no sense at all? Well, im at one of those moments... Time for some sugar, perhaps ;-)

Fred.

In fact, that's what I meant, picking a new value from the wavetable and sending it to the DAC.

Sorry for having been not precise enough, me and Shakespeare's language are two completely different worlds. That's why I try to reduce everything I want to say down to simple words which I can chain up without looking anything up in a dictionary...

And concerning our little OT discussion above: ;-)

Fred, those Animoog animations are it traversing the X Y matrix under program control. One would hope that the theremini allows you to map X and Y to pitch and volume. Don't fret about the "soundscape" jargon, that's just sales pitch.

I think you might find this video interesting. In the first half hour they look at the Haken Continuum and animoog, and reference the theremin (expressive interface like Continuum) and Moog's April Fool polyphonic etherwave (animoog can do this for real, well, kind of).

Also I noticed that the Haken guy favours turning off the pitch-correcting portmanteau on the Continuum and learning to play it the hard way. 

Many thanks for pasting that great video, Gordon! Really interesting, the whole thing..

Its a shame the audio quality of the Animoog playback was so bad - I mean, the Serge Analogue synth was just wonderful, but at probably close to £50k, following it with an Animoog was a bit unfair ;-)

I havent yet heard anything from the Amimoog that I like - but I will reserve my judgements till I have heard what the theremini really sounds like played by a thereminist who can play - I expect that even if there had been a hidden RCA being played as badly as the theremini was on those demos, I wouldnt be impressed by "its sound".. (if I saw that it was an RCA though, I would probably have heard it differently ;-)

Also, I must be careful - All "likes" and "dislikes are the result of the actions in my "bio computer" - the same computer which is simultaniously processing emotional reactions etc related to Moog and the theremini and my life - Any kind of "objectivity" under these conditions are probably even less reliable than usual!

All I know is that I am personally  tilting even more towards heterodyning and analogue since this issue came up than I was before, but im not sure that I have good reason for this.

Fred.

And some more info about the theremini, specifically a few clues about the MIDI.

http://createdigitalmusic.com/2014/01/making-theremin-digital-moog-theremini-works-midi-brings/

There will be CC MIDI output for Pitch and Volume. The Pitch CC output will be scaled to the range of the Pitch Antenna and will also be “post-quantization” – this will allow for CC tracking that is either fully-contiuous, or fully-discreet and anywhere in between which will create some very interesting controller possibilities.

Many parameters are also available for modification via MIDI Input. These will allow users to modify the presets and the way the instrument sounds as well as several global setup parameters.. We are not currently announcing an “editor” for the instrument, but customers who use MIDI will be able to access these very easily. An example of this would be how fast the scan-rate is for the wavetable synthesis engine.

From GordonC's link: "the baguette from space"