Very New To The Theremin ~ Want One BAD!

Pretty amazing talent. Was I correct in my assumption that if I buy a theremin with only volume and pitch controls ~ the B3 ~ I can add the additional sound options with a guitar amp or perhaps a peddle? Also, you said you could improve the sound of the EW Standard, how?

- Dean -

The B3 is a good theremin with a slightly better sound I have been told but I don't have experience with it. The Moog has easier resale value. There are several internal tricks to improve the EWS sound. I have my own which can be heard in this sample. It is an easy $5 mod from Radio Shack without hacking the pcb. Listen.mp3  I can't play a tune and you have no way to compare but keep it in mind.

People mention add-ons to improve the post audio sound but that is a personal thing which I have found most keep secret.

I am not a musician rather a professor of the theremin who explores natural possibilities demonstrating results for those that can hear it.

Christopher

Guitar amps have a lot of artificial effects that work great with the theremin. An EWS usually needs something to cool down a hot signal but that is also $5 from Amazon.

"Also, you said you could improve the sound of the EW Standard, how?" - Rokitman

Hi Dean,

The core EWS has (IMO) one major design flaw that affects its sound - this flaw can be overcome with a small board added inside the theremin which you can buy from Thierry.. If you are able to construct a simple circuit, you can build a simple buffer like the YAEWSBM as described here which fixes the design flaw (but might be completely different to what Thierry does - my understanding is that Thierrys board has buffers, but might have some 'extra' component/s.. Thierrys circuit is not published.. Despite inferences that the YAEWSBM  is "dangerous" do not be put off - there is ABSOLUTELY no risk to the theremins oscillators or any other part of the theremins circuit from a correctly built YAEWSBM, and I fear that these inferences are put out to disuade people from building the YAEWSBM for less than honest reasons)

You can hear an example of an EWS that has the YAEWSBM  fitted here (you-tube video).

At a technical level, the "flaw" is that the oscillators in the EW are taken directly to the mixer, and interfere with each other as a result, this causes the bass to "stutter" and distort in non-musical ways. Adding a buffer to each oscillator before signals are mixed solves this problem.

One thing to beware of here (as everywhere) is that lots of people have vested interests in promoting their ideas about theremins and declaring themselves "experts" or "professors" - Dont believe them - this is an extremely tiny interest group, with lots of people fighting for "top spot" - There are several glamorous web sites that pummel unsuspecting theremin explorers with convincing rubbish.

I do need to say here that, IMO, Thierry does have the right to his status as an (probably the) expert on the EW - Without doubt, he has a far deeper understanding and more hands-on expierience with the EW than probably anyone else.

Just be careful! - Unless you have a comprehensive understanding of electronics (degree level or equivalent) you are not likely to be able to discern facts from fiction without digging deeply - Even electronics consultants and engineers like myself have difficulty at times with the finer details of theremins, and need a lot of thinking and study to filter the data.

Fred.

" Was I correct in my assumption that if I buy a theremin with only volume and pitch controls ~ the B3 ~ I can add the additional sound options with a guitar amp or perhaps a peddle? " - Rokitman

There is a lot you can do with external processing - IMO, it comes down to what you want to do.. Its like with all synthesisers, its easier to produce the sound of a violin if you have an oscillator that produces a ramp waveform - much more difficult to do if your oscillator only produces a square wave!

The more versatile the sound coming from the theremin is (the more tone adjustment available) the more one can modify this sound externally to what you want (if you need to).

Thank you Christopher and Fred.

Although I understand about a third of what you're saying ~ electronically ~ I can see I've come to the right place for accurate and honest information. Fortunately, I have an older brother who is very knowledgeable in electronics. So if some day I decide to mod my theremin, I'm sure he can handle the job. And I'll certainly be coming back here for the proper advice to do so.

The more I read about and hear the theremin, the more I want one. Especially when I hear those theremin that have been modded. It really does add quite a bit of richness to their sound, doesn't it?. My son plays guitar and knows quite a lot about amps and foot peddles. So I can pick his brain as to what I may need. I'm assuming I won't need a large complicated model. Something small enough to be portable with a few popular affects.

Fred, I was watching the Silent Night video link you provided and I noticed something. The player changes octaves twice in the performance. But it doesn't seem ~ at least to MY eyes ~ that his distance from the vertical antenna changes all that much. Is this just an optical illusion? I do know that the pitch control changes the distance with which the frequencies are spread ~ if that makes any sense. So the larger the wavelength, the larger the area that a single tone may be played. I'm I correct here? Would this make learning to play the theremin easier, at least at first?

And last. I know there is no tried and true answer to THIS question. But on average, how long would you say it would take to learn to play a song like Silent Night? At least to the point of not being dragged off stage by a hook.

Thank you all for your time and opinions. If you're trying to sway my decision away from buying a theremin...you're doing a piss poor job. ;)

- Dean -

P.S.

I hate to be a nag, but where can I find some good resources for theremin lessons online?

- Dean -

"The player changes octaves twice in the performance. But it doesn't seem ~ at least to MY eyes ~ that his distance from the vertical antenna changes all that much. Is this just an optical illusion?" --- "So the larger the wavelength, the larger the area that a single tone may be played. I'm I correct here?" - Dean

First, "wavelength" has nothing to do with it! - There is one thing, and one thing only, which determines pitch - this thing is capacitance!

The capacitance to "ground" that the pitch antenna "sees" is what determines the pitch of the sound .. and the pitch antenna "sums" all sources of ground capacitance - the floor, the walls, other grounded equipment, wires, lights - and the players body (legs,torso,arms,hands).. Any change in position of ANY of these will affect the pitch.

If you look at Bisem playing "silent Night" you can see that just before the pitch drops an octave, he moves his body - its no major movement, but it doesn't need to be - The body has a large surface area* with respect to the antenna - moving it away from the antenna even a little will drop the pitch significantly.

It should be noted that pitch is NOT set by the closest 'object' to the antenna! It is set by the total capacitance - Capacitance is a function of distance and area, so moving the hand closer to the antenna increases the pitch, but having a finger pointing at the antenna with the tip of the finger say 20cm from it will raise the pitch less than having the hand angled (fingers bent) so as to increase the surface area, and having the knuckles 20cm from the antenna.

*All points on all grounded and conductive surfaces in line-of-sight to any point on the antenna, form a complex capacitive 'matrix' - each contributing capacitance as a function of its distance from the antenna, and all these capacitances are summed.. More distant 'points' contribute less capacitance to the sum, but if an object has large surface area in line-of-sight to the antenna, there will be more of these 'points' to sum... In fact, there are no 'points' its an integral, but its often easier to analyze capacitive distributions in a piecewise-linear manner.

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"I hate to be a nag, but where can I find some good resources for theremin lessons online?"

See:

http://www.thereminworld.com/Article/14661/10-tips-for-new-theremin-owners

http://www.thereminworld.com/play-the-theremin

I am NOT a thereminist - so the following is probably just me babbling! ;-)

As to "how long" it takes to learn to play - I think there are many answers.. There are some people who can play a tune quite quickly (these are usually people who have played other instruments, particularly violin or cello) - I introduced the theremin to probably several thousand people who had never seen one before - Some people came back daily for a week, and played for about an hour or less each day - They had only my basic introductory tuition, and the instruments were pitch-only (with auto-muting) - I would say that most were a long way from Bisems level by the end of the week.... I think we may be talking about an intense few months, or year of reasonable practice time to get to bisems level - I hit a major obstacle with coordinating volume and pitch hands, and never mastered this before health forced me to give up..... I am fine on pitch - can (or could)  play anything - but it took all my concentration.. nothing left for the volume hand! :-(

But there were two people who were exceptional - One was playing along with Clara Rockmore's "Hebrew Melody" perfectly at the end of the week - So well, I wanted him to stay in contact - We had a drink and chat together, but he had no interest - he was on a mission to travel the world and play every instrument he could lay his hands on and without any pride or boasting told me he could play any instrument he ever picked up, within a few days... He was not musically trained - but had played fiddles and cellos and was just having fun!

The other was a lad of about 12 - he dragged his parents to the show every day, and was in love with the theremin.. By the end of the week he could play - not as well as Bisem, but at least as good as me! (thats not saying much - he was probably better).. His parents contacted me some weeks later to ask for advice about which keboard to buy him.... they thought the theremin was too limited :-(

Must just say that the instruments were pitch only - And these are easier (but extremely limiting).. "True" theremins must have both pitch and volume antennas.

There are forums here where musicians are better placed to answer your questions about playing -

I am mainly (almost exclusively) at the technical end of the TW spectrum ;-)

Fred.

 oh - with theremin playing, sadly, there is extremely little chance of ever being "dragged off stage with a hook" - For some reason, the oly people who boo thereminists seem to be other thereminists!  ;-)

I was able to play Silent night within 6 months "well". Luckily, I am a vocalist firstly and that has helped me greatly in my progression because I play the theremin as if I was singing the piece. But I believe that it all depends on how much you practice, how well you are able to grasp the 3 dimension thing and your sense of pitch. This is a video of my playing after the 3 year mark... You can go through my channel and find early videos and see the progression... :) Happy thereminizing!!

Hi Amey,

Looking at your astounding progression has been inspiring - but could also be potentially discouraging to someone perhaps.. If they think they "should" be able to match your progress, or didn't realize that your progress is exceptional.

You are exceptionally talented on this instrument - In my last, I mentioned having had thousands of people "play" the theremin for the first time - and there were probably about 200 who came back and tried to play on more than one occasion.. Out of this mass of people, there were two who were exceptional, two who just "got it" - I believe you are one of these kind of people.

I am not saying that the others were hopeless (but most were ;-) Just that it doesn't "just" come down to how much you practice - it also comes down to innate ability.. If it took you 6 months to play "silent night" well, then I think most others will be lucky if they achieved the same level of proficiency even if they put in equal effort, in less than a year.

And even if they played it as "well" after a year, I doubt that it would sound as good..... ;-)

Fred.

OMG Amey,

You brought tears to my eyes, in a world so cruel the only hope left was in the children...

My prayer is to not be left behind.

Christopher

Wow you guys!! You are very sweet to watching and commenting, I am always leery to post videos on here :) So thank you very much :)

Fred, it is sort of "weird" to read that you think I am exceptionally gifted at the theremin... Cause I tried the guitar, the harp, the cello ~ and I truly s*cked at it. But I wonder if I put as much effort in any of these instrument as I do with the theremin, maybe I could have been decent at playing one of them. I truly believe though that you have to put in your practice time in anything to get to a proficient level and many more hours to become pro. I was a bit obsessed with my playing at first: I just couldn't stand being less than "good" so I would practice at time 2 hours a day, then went down to 1 hour. Lately, I have been putting 45 to 1 hour a day and skip a day or so per week... And when I do skip, I miss it terribly, and does show!!! 

Wow Amey, simply wow!

That performance was astoundingly beautiful. Thank you so much for sharing it with us. This piece only makes me want to learn this amazing instrument even more. I can only hope someday I can play at something near your level.

And Fred. Her performance doesn't discourage me in the least. In fact, it inspires me. I think in learning to play such a complex instrument ~ or any instrument for that matter ~ one should have a firm understanding of his own talent and expectations. I will never learn to play the Ukulele like Jake Shimabukuro. But I can certainly shoot for something similar.

With every Theremin video I see, my excitement for learning this grows along with it. Very few musical instruments share it's haunting uniqueness and beauty.

Thank you Amey so much for keeping my enthusiasm alive. I will definitely check out your channel.

- Dean -